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Anna Delaney: Hello and welcome
to the ISMG Editors' Panel. I'm

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Anna Delaney. And this is our
weekly spot where the global

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team discuss the latest
information and cybersecurity

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news stories, features and
trends. I'm joined today by Tom

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Field, senior vice president of
editorial; Suparna Goswami,

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associate editor at ISMG Asia;
and Rashmi Ramesh, senior

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subeditor for our global news
desk. Very good to see you all.

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Tom Field: Nice to be seen.

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Suparna Goswami: Glad to be
back, Anna.

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Rashmi Ramesh: Great to be here,
as always.

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Anna Delaney: So Suparna, there
is a spectacular bridge behind

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you. Where are you?

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Suparna Goswami: So the
background is that of Howrah

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Bridge in Calcutta, or Kolkata
as they call it now. So it is an

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iconic landmark. It is a huge
steel bridge over the Hooghly

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River. Now it is considered one
of the, I think, longest

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cantilever bridges in the world.
So I'll be traveling at the fact

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that I chose this because I'll
be traveling to this city first

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time for work for ISMG. So I
have traveled to the city

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multiple times before but this
is the first time I am traveling

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for work. I have an RT scheduled
in a couple of weeks. So yes,

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really, looking forward to
meeting the CIOs from that city

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at the IT Roundtable that I will
be hosting and know their views

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on cloud adoption, about the
maturity of the market, never

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really interacted with
practitioners from this part of

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the city.

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Anna Delaney: Also, we look
forward to more virtual

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backgrounds then from the area.
Excellent! Rashmi, this is well,

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Tom, was saying it looks like
the States but

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Tom Field: The Grand Canyon to
be honest with you

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Rashmi Ramesh: Well, this is
where I live, about like 30, 40

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kilometers from where I live.
This is still Bangalore. It's a

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short hike up maybe about five
kilometers. So it's literally

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like an hour's drive from the
city. It's lovely.

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Tom Field: Part of Bangalore,
I've never seen.

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Suparna Goswami: I am sure most
of us have not.

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Anna Delaney: Tom, you're at a
party.

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Tom Field: I am milking my
recent vacation to Orlando, and,

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you know, this is in honor of
course we celebrated

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Independence Day in the United
States last week, some grand

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fireworks from Magic Kingdom.

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Anna Delaney: Beautiful. So what
happens there just as fireworks

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display was Minnie and Mickey
Mouse come out?

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Tom Field: You know, if you can
see above what would be my left

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shoulder, you see the turret
right there. At the end of the

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fireworks, Tinker Bell flies
from there to another part of

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the park. I shouldn't say this
but on a zipline, but it is

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pretty impressive.

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Anna Delaney: Magical.

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Tom Field: Well, I don't wanna
take the magic away from

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anybody.

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Anna Delaney: No, well, I am
sort of not as fun this week.

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But I'm going local today. This
is the River Thames behind me.

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Taken on a recent walk on a
summer's day, so ...

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Tom Field: Again, that's part of
the Thames I have never seen.

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Where's that?

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Anna Delaney: In Surrey, so
maybe 30 minutes out of London.

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Tom Field: So I was gonna see it
from South Bank or from Tower

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Bridge.

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Anna Delaney: Yes, it's long
river. Well, so Bank of

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America's 2023 CISO survey was
released last month. And one of

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the topics that came up was this
concept of vendor consolidation.

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So what are the trends you want
to bring to the group?

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Tom Field: It is, it's
interesting, because there are a

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few things in there that really
got my interest. And I wasn't

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going to reveal the source of
the survey. So, I'm not sure

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they want that information to be
told to the public, but it's out

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there now. So we're gonna go
with it. But some things that

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got my attention. You know, they
did a survey of X number of

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CISOs talking about some of the
trends. And one of the things I

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found validating was the CISOs
are saying that they've got

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decent, discretionary budget for
new acquisitions, new solutions

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in 2023. That's consistent with
what I've seen and heard in our

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Roundtable discussions at our
events, is that it hasn't been a

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matter of level funding or less
funding for security. Security

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actually has been doing pretty
well, particularly as there are

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more threats and more incidents,
because it's always easier to

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get money when, you know, God
forbid, your organization gets

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struck, but when one of your
competitors gets struck, budgets

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open up. So I found that
validating. I also found it

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validating that you're seeing
spend on endpoint security,

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network security, cloud. This is
consistent not just with the

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discussions we have, but
Suparna, you can chime in on

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this that when we get approached
to lead Roundtable discussions,

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often they're on endpoint
security, cloud security,

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especially some on vendor in
third-party risk management. So

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I found it validating that they
have money that is being spent

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there. Now, one of the points
you brought this up, Anna, is

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in, we've discussed this a lot
in our own internal meetings has

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been the notion of vendor
consolidation. And there's been

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this discussion that CISOs want
to work with fewer vendors that

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they want to consolidate, and
that they're making a shift from

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discrete solutions or the old
defense in depth or expense in

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depth as I've heard it called by
Forrester to more of a platform

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approach. So instead of working
with multiple vendors to work

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with a Microsoft more
exclusively, a Cisco, a Palo

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Alto Networks, and what the
CISOs' survey said, that I've

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heard consistently is hold on a
minute, maybe that's not what

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CISOs want. Maybe that's more of
a storyline that the vendors

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want to, that the platform
vendors want to push out into

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the public. And I do believe
that's the case, as I've had

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this discussion with CISOs at
our Roundtable events, it's

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been, I'm looking for something
that's going to protect me on

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all fronts, and I want high
grades for everything. When you

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go with discrete solutions, you
can get the best to have high

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grades everywhere. When you go
with a platform, the platform

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might be an A plus, on two out
of three areas. But the third

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area could be a B minus or a C.
How do I go to my senior

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management or the board and say,
we're going to be superior in

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these two areas, but we're going
to be average here. Are you okay

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with that? And what does average
mean? And how do we even

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convince our cyber insurers that
this is the way to go? So I've

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seen a lot of pushback from
CISOs on this notion of making

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the platform approach. And this
survey came out and said exactly

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that, that this is less of
something that's coming up from

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individual enterprises, but more
of a storyline that's pushed by

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the vendors that would like to
see organizations move to a

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platform approach. So I found
that very validating, and wanted

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to bring that to our discussion
here today.

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Anna Delaney: Excellent. And
this view was actually reflected

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in a conversation I had with a
Gartner analyst recently, who

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brought up that well-known
phrase, the cybersecurity market

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is always consolidating, but
never consolidated. And he said

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like you, there is a lot of
consolidation, but there are

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more and more vendors, there are
new threats every day, and

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therefore new products to tackle
those threats. So his advice was

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when looking to consolidate,
don't think about these projects

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as finite projects. Remember to
keep it agile and fluid, think

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of them more as ongoing
exercises.

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Tom Field: You know, Anna,
something else from the BoA's

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report that I found encouraging
is that the notion that CISOs

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were keeping some discretionary
budget, so they can invest in

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new solutions and new vendors,
and there's a recognition there

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that innovation is going to come
from the startup community, it's

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going to come from someone that
we don't know about today Isn't

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necessarily going to come from
Microsoft or Cisco. And I find

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that validated by our own
discussions, we see lots of

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CISOs coming to our events these
days wanting to have very

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specific conversations with the
vendors that they might not be

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working with now, to find out
what is it you do? How can you

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help me? I think there's a great
appetite out there for

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innovation. And there's money
out there to be spent on vendors

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that come along that are
offering something new.

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Anna Delaney: Yeah.

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Suparna Goswami: So Tom, just
curious in your Roundtables, so

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you don't hear so much talks
around budget? Because here when

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I have Roundtables, yes, of
course, what you said is

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absolutely true. They're looking
for those point solutions, which

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are really, which have those
expertise, but at the same time,

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they're they too are worried
about their budget as well.

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Tom Field: When we talk about
resources Suparna, the

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conversation is less about
financial resources and more

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about finite human resources. I
don't have the people that I can

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deploy to manage all these
different solutions and

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relationships. And that's part
of what's driving the

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consolidation is I don't have
people that can manage all this.

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I don't have visibility across
all these different arenas. And

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we're looking to consolidate
that view. So it's less about

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the money and it's more about, I
don't have the people how can I

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get access to talent and
solutions that I don't have

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in-house? And the money seems to
be there for that.

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Anna Delaney: Very good. Well,
thank you for bringing that to

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our attention, Tom. Suparna,
speaking of innovation, you

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recently had the opportunity to
interview the global CIO of Palo

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Alto, Meerah Rajavel. So tell us
about what you discussed.

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Suparna Goswami: Absolutely,
yes. So as you said, the global

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CIO of Palo Alto Networks,
Meerah Rajavel, she came down to

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India for three four days and
ISMG not only had the

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opportunity to meet her but
interview her as well. So we did

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talk about, of course, we could
not miss it about generative AI.

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I asked her how she is using AI
to improve the overall IT

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efficiency in her organization,
not so much what Palo Alto is

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doing in the products, but what
she's doing as a CIO in her

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organization, and she gave some
good examples. So one of the

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examples she gave was when a
product gets launched, so

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typically when this happens a
product gets launched, the

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product team produces a lot of
documentation that becomes the

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basis for the marketing team. So
typically, the time the product

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documentation is ready, and the
product is finally launched, it

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takes about four to six weeks to
finally launch a product.

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Because a lot of artifacts like
your blogs, your PR activities

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other things are really planned
before a product is getting

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launched. This is where Palo
Alto thought of leveraging

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generative AI. And they reduced
the entire process from four to

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six weeks to two to three days.
And, they brought the product

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engineering and the product
marketing team in a singular

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fashion because the content is
being produced by AI. Of course,

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they did not eliminate the human
element completely. It was

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overlooked by the humans, they
were there was patchup done by

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the humans, but 70 to 80% of the
content was produced by the

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human. So yes, generative AI is
a very core business strategy

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for Palo Alto, and, but to be
honest, they have been in the AI

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space for a long time, I did
check with her that what is new,

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you have been in the AI space
for a long time. But of course,

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it was mainly the ML model that
they were focusing on. But now

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she said that she wants to put
AI right in the center of their

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strategy game and not just add
AI on top of any product, you

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know, or just put it at the
center of what is whatever is

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being done. Yeah.

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Anna Delaney: Did you also talk
about cybersecurity?

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Suparna Goswami: It was about
cybersecurity as well. But it

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was more on, you know, the
whatever she is doing on

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generative AI. She did mention
about a product that they've

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come up come out with on it's
what it is called, yeah, XSIAM.

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Yes, XSIAM. And it is on
automating SOC. But mainly we

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did speak about because she was
the CIO, I was just curious to

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know how she is handling or what
is her strategy when it comes to

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your generative AI, and there
are lot of other things that she

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has planned as well. On
generative AI, for example, she

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said that generative AI will
have a significant impact on

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efficiency, on speed and on
experience. So she explained to

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me one of the initiatives that
she is driving. So between IT,

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HR and some other functions,
there are usually an employee

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will have multiple questions,
like they will have my laptop is

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not functioning or there will be
a question there will be queries

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around salary or career growth
or switch, can I switch to the

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other team? So Palo Alto, she
mentioned this, is a company

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which has around 15,000
employees, but they get around

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400,000 queries every month. And
it takes them days to weeks, and

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sometimes even months to respond
to these queries. So this is

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where she has brought AI. She
said that of course one of the

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solutions that was proposed to
her was that a great search

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function will do but the
argument is that it will throw

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up multiple options. So if
you're a new employee, you won't

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know how to go about it. So
there she is, again, leveraging

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AI. They're looking to make
available 90% of the information

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in the form of an AI assistant.
But again, like she's, like I

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said before, she doesn't want to
completely do away with the

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human element. So the rest 10%
can be addressed by humans. The

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human loop is necessary for the
personal touch. But yes, 90%

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will be, is being made available
by an AI assistant. And even

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you're transforming the
go-to-market experience that I

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just spoke about. The products
team produces a lot of content,

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which is used by the marketing
team while launching a product.

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So she is producing 80% of the
content is being written by AI

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and the rest 20% is being
improvised by humans. And the

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third category, which is she's
focusing on is information at

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the fingertip of customers. The
customers, they can they should

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be able to experience the
product. That's what the aim is.

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The aim is to make Palo Alto
product smart enough so that

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they can let the customers know
in advance what are the changes

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they can expect. And they and
give them the choice of auto

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remediations. But these are some
of the things that she

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discussed. Of course, there were
other topics that she discussed

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on industry cloud platforms, how
that is gaining, that is a major

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trend that is going on. So that
industry cloud platform

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essentially accelerates cloud
adoption by appealing to

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particular industry and business
consumers. And this is not

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really targeted at early cloud
adopters. But yes, who are

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little mature and by offering
them adaptable, and you know,

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probably relevant industry
solutions. So that is one of the

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trends that she is also seeing,
industry cloud platforms.

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Anna Delaney: Excellent. Very
thorough, and all these

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generative AI use cases really
helpful. Thanks, Suparna. Look

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forward to seeing that published
on our sites.

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Tom Field: I'm gonna tell you
too, Suparna, I'm looking

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forward to as we get out and
start our Roundtable discussions

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and Summits for the second half
of this year, to see how the

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generative AI discussion is
different in July than it was in

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January. We've had six months
for organizations to get their

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feet under them and get a better
understanding of this and what

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it means to their organizations.
I want to start hearing about

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them.

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Anna Delaney: Yeah.

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Suparna Goswami: Alright.

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Anna Delaney: Rashmi, you've
written a very interesting

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feature this week, stripping the
magnetic stripe, what's taking

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so long and the premise of the
article is that the world is

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moving on from the magnetic
stripe payment cards with one

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notable exception. Tell us what
or who that notable exception

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is.

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Rashmi Ramesh: Yeah, so we've
been talking about magnetic

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stripes and cybersecurity risks
for, what, more than a decade

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now. And it got me thinking, why
is this still an issue? I

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remember Mastercard, saying that
it would soon phase out magnetic

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stripes. Why hadn't that
happened yet? And how were all

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the moving parts in this
ecosystem dealing with the

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security risks? So Suparna and I
decided to ask the experts, both

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payments and cybersecurity. So
turns out that the U.S., which

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is one of the biggest markets
for payment cards, is also one

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of the biggest holdouts when it
comes to moving to chips

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entirely. So everyone in the
ecosystem, credit card issuers,

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your banks and consumers all
agree that the magnetic stripe

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is prone to hacking. So that
begs the question, right? Like,

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why is the U.S. still clinging
on to a technology that is more

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than 60 years old now? So the
primary answer to this is a

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thing that runs the world -
money. So replacing them costs a

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lot of money. And it's a tedious
job, and it's no specific

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organization's responsibility.
So why is it expensive and

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tedious? Mostly because small
merchants, millions of them,

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need to be convinced to bear the
cost of updating their POS

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machines. And they must be
convinced to do it, when the

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payment process they have in
place now works perfectly well.

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So take gas stations, for
example. They're one of the

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largest everyday spend
categories for card payments,

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and they spread across the
country. They're also the

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costliest to deploy new software
in. And then there's the card

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brands who cannot really just
wake up one day and choose to

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not support a standard. They
have mandates where they need to

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comply with payments standards,
such as the ISO, which defines

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the smallest of things like, you
know, the shape, the layout, and

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even font that can be used on a
card. But none of this is to say

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that we're always going to be
living in the 60s. What really

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helped bring the move to chip
is that card networks eventually

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shifted the liability of any
fraud that happens on magnetic

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stripes to the merchant. So
basically, if there was a fraud,

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at the point of sale, like a
counterfeit card being used,

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then the loss would be borne by
whatever party wasn't EVM

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compliant. And more often than
not, that was a merchant. But

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this liability shift was also
staggered. It did not apply

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everywhere, all at once. So we
spoke about the millions of gas

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station payment terminals
earlier, right. So they were

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given a little bit more time
than others to make that

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transition. So this change sort
of began around 2015. At that

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time, there were about billions
of cards circulating in the

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U.S., most of which were
magnetic stripe cards, which had

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shelf lives of about four to
five years. So that transition

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to chip began after that. So it
took time for merchants to roll

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out the hardware for issuers to
replace all the cards that were

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already in the market. And for
processors to get the technology

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in place. So eight years later,
we're still in the process of

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phasing out. And there is
concern about disruption to

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customer experience. What if the
chip doesn't work and there's no

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fallback magstripe? What if the
payment isn't processed

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correctly due to the hardware
issues? So the answer to why we

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still have magstripe is a
vicious circle at this point.

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Tom Field: It's all my country.
It's so embarrassing. To tell

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you Rashmi, I remember it was
maybe a dozen years ago, when

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the U.S. started to go to what
they call chip and signature.

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You know, it used to - go to
your merchant would use the chip

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card. And then they would check
the signature on the back of

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your card against your other
signature, your driver's

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license, whatever it may be.
Very few merchants ever looked

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at that. You could go, you could
use any card you want. As long

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as it went through, they worked.
They were fine with that.

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Rashmi Ramesh: Yeah

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Tom Field: We're seeing a lot
more in the U.S. of tap-and-go

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payments. And so I think we're
getting over some of the

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hurdles. But honestly, I think
one of the things that's helping

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us get over these hurdles is a
younger generation of consumers

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that are used to different forms
of payment and are very happy

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00:19:51,120 --> 00:19:54,780
with the tap and go, used to the
chip. And we're losing some of

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the legacy dependency on the old
magstripe. So I'm encouraged

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that there will be some changes,
but I think it's a generational

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change more than its a
technological change.

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Anna Delaney: Rashmi, you raised
the point that this is not just

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about cost - it is costly to
remove the magnetic stripe. But

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this is not just the merchants,
it's to do with the community

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00:20:17,220 --> 00:20:20,100
itself - the card community
itself. Tell us more.

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00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:23,940
Rashmi Ramesh: Yeah. So you're
right that it is about the

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00:20:23,940 --> 00:20:29,430
card-issuing community as well.
So those CEO of the merchant

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00:20:29,430 --> 00:20:33,420
advisory group, whom I spoke to
his name is John, I hope I'm

353
00:20:33,420 --> 00:20:37,410
pronouncing this correctly,
Drechny. So basically, this

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00:20:37,410 --> 00:20:42,240
group represents more than 150
U.S. merchants. So he said that

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if you look through Mastercard's
announcement, for example, it

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00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,620
says that prepaid cards don't
really have a timeline for the

357
00:20:49,620 --> 00:20:54,300
removal of magnetic stripe. So
it essentially means that even

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00:20:54,300 --> 00:20:59,280
if merchants install new EMV
equipment, they will still be

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00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:03,210
required to support magnetic
stripe. So if cards are going to

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00:21:03,210 --> 00:21:06,090
be in the market, it doesn't
really make sense for everyone

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00:21:06,090 --> 00:21:09,360
to install the new equipment,
especially not in a short time

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frame, and definitely not in
haste.

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Anna Delaney: Excellent. Well,
thank you very much. I implore

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everybody to go read your
article. It's a great analysis

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of where we are at the moment.
So and finally, just for fun,

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what's on your cyber tech summer
reading list?

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Tom Field: I will say for me,
it's less about physical

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00:21:31,530 --> 00:21:35,070
reading, and more about digital.
I'm spending a lot of time on

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00:21:35,070 --> 00:21:39,300
our own education site,
CyberEd.io, where we've launched

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00:21:39,300 --> 00:21:44,760
just a graduate courses in
cybersecurity education. And in

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00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:48,060
the time that I'm not spending
on the road for our events and

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00:21:48,060 --> 00:21:50,910
for our Roundtable discussions,
I was spending more time there

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just trying to enhance my own
education. This world, this

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industry is moving so fast, and
it takes considerable more effort to

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00:21:58,140 --> 00:22:01,260
try to keep up and we've got a
great place that we can try to

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do that. So that's where I'm
spending my time this summer.

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Anna Delaney: Well said.
Suparna?

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Suparna Goswami: Yes, in fact,
one is a physical book that I

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00:22:11,190 --> 00:22:15,120
want to read. It was recommended
by a security practitioner from

380
00:22:15,120 --> 00:22:18,930
Australia, Chirag Joshi. He
recommended "The Wires of War:

381
00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:21,840
Technology and the Global
Struggle for Power." So it

382
00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:26,400
essentially explains the high
stakes, the cyberwar brewing

383
00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,570
between the Western democracies
and China and Russia, and the

384
00:22:30,570 --> 00:22:35,130
social disinformation risk to
the U.S., especially that can

385
00:22:35,160 --> 00:22:38,970
probably bring democracy,
damage democracy. So the book

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00:22:38,970 --> 00:22:41,370
talks about that was highly
recommended by him, I plan to

387
00:22:41,370 --> 00:22:46,140
purchase it. I have planned to
order it soon, probably sometime

388
00:22:46,140 --> 00:22:52,380
this week. And the other one
which I follow a lot in ISMG

389
00:22:52,380 --> 00:22:57,450
websites are the webinars. So I
do go to the webinars and they

390
00:22:57,450 --> 00:23:01,050
have some of the vendors, they
have some fantastic sometimes

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00:23:01,410 --> 00:23:05,430
PPTs that, you know, especially
when it comes to cloud or OT

392
00:23:05,430 --> 00:23:08,610
security, I specifically look at
those webinars, and even they

393
00:23:08,610 --> 00:23:12,000
have those white papers that I
read. But yes, I will. I will

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00:23:12,000 --> 00:23:16,350
also, I plan to probably, you
know, I'll take Tom's advice,

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00:23:16,380 --> 00:23:20,580
CyberEd.io. And I'll probably go
visit that site as well.

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00:23:21,060 --> 00:23:22,470
Tom Field: Well you make a good
point, Suparna. I probably

397
00:23:22,470 --> 00:23:24,600
record four or five of those
webinars a week. So there's

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00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:26,040
education every day right there.

399
00:23:26,070 --> 00:23:28,080
Suparna Goswami: Yes, those
webinars are great.

400
00:23:29,430 --> 00:23:29,970
Anna Delaney: Rashmi?

401
00:23:31,050 --> 00:23:34,530
Rashmi Ramesh: Mine are two
really cool crypto books: crypto

402
00:23:34,530 --> 00:23:38,490
security books. One is called
"Tracers in the Dark," by Andy

403
00:23:38,490 --> 00:23:43,260
Greenberg. It's about law
enforcement, tracing ill-gotten

404
00:23:43,260 --> 00:23:48,540
cryptocurrency and "The Lazarus
Heist," by Geoff White, which is

405
00:23:48,540 --> 00:23:52,860
so cool. And it's about North
Korea, how the adventures really

406
00:23:52,890 --> 00:23:56,940
of North Korean threat actors.
Its, they're both really

407
00:23:56,940 --> 00:24:02,160
amazing. And I've read half of
one of them, and definitely on

408
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:04,440
my list for the next couple of
months.

409
00:24:04,980 --> 00:24:07,080
Anna Delaney: And the Lazarus
Heist was serialized, I think on

410
00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:07,500
a podcast.

411
00:24:07,500 --> 00:24:07,950
Rashmi Ramesh: Yes

412
00:24:09,780 --> 00:24:12,330
Anna Delaney: There are always
the audio channels as well.

413
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:15,420
Well, I'm looking at Yuval
Harari's "21 Lessons for the

414
00:24:15,420 --> 00:24:19,800
21st Century." It's interesting
because I look forward to what

415
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:23,880
he creates post ChatGPT that was
obviously written even before

416
00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:28,440
COVID. So I'm sure he has
thoughts to add. And also one

417
00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:31,440
that's caught my eye "Impromptu:
Amplifying Our Humanity Through

418
00:24:31,470 --> 00:24:38,220
AI" written by Reid Hoffman,
along with GPT-4. So couple of

419
00:24:40,140 --> 00:24:40,590
...

420
00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:46,020
Well, this has been excellent
and educational. Thank you so

421
00:24:46,020 --> 00:24:48,390
much, Tom, Suparna and Rashmi.
Until next time.

422
00:24:48,420 --> 00:24:49,110
Suparna Goswami: Thank you,
Anna.

423
00:24:50,430 --> 00:24:52,350
Anna Delaney: And thanks so much
for watching. Until next time

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00:24:54,210 --> 00:24:54,240
...